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#1 2016-11-29 17:55:45

Sighum
Member
Registered: 2016-11-29
Posts: 3

Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Dear forum,

I really like the Cab Controller. However there is one annoying issue (at least with Train Simulator 2017). There seems to be a dead area between accelerating and decelerating. Let me try to explain.

I push the stick all the way to full throttle and the display in TS2017 shows me full throttle. Now I pull back the stick slowly to the center but nothing seems to happen in TS2017 for the first centimeter. After approximately one centimeter the stick in the simulation starts moving.

Same happens when I pull back the joystick to activate the dynamic brake. I pull the stick slowly back to the center but the brake persists for one centimeter. Only after that the brake slowly starts to get switched off.

Can I do anything about it? If feels very unnatural because the absolute position of the Cab Controller's stick seems to be independent from the the stick in the simulation. Instead of using my feel I need to watch the screen. As if the stick is very lose or something.

Thanks in advance.

...Chris

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#2 2016-11-30 11:24:30

PIE Liam
Technical Support Specialist
From: Williamston, MI
Registered: 2016-01-21
Posts: 50
Website

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Chris,
How old is the RailDriver? This is not an known issue, have you tried re-calibrating the unit ? The tool can be found here C:\Program Files (x86)\PI Engineering\MacroWorks 3.1\Devices\RailDriver\RD Calibration , just double the application to launch the tool. Are you seeing this behavior on every train?

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#3 2016-11-30 16:10:40

Sighum
Member
Registered: 2016-11-29
Posts: 3

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

I bought the RailDriver a week ago from Aerosoft/Germany.
Yes, I just re-ran the calibration. Nothing changed.
The behavior happens on three trains. Two of them german - one british.
The pneumatic brake and the reverse have hardly any noticable dead area by the way.

Another way to describe my problem:
Consider the brake/throttle stick as a range from +100% to -100%.
The area between "throttle idle" (=0%) and half the way to "throttle full" (50%) area is dead. Once I pass the 50% the lever in the game starts moving.
Then when I want to take back power I slowly move the lever back to idle. The first half of the way (between 100% and 50%) is dead again. Then the in-game lever starts moving between 50% and 0%.
Same happens for the dynamic brake.

I suspect either a configuration/software problem or the stick that is not reporting proper values. Would be great to know how to fix that.


I just tried the RailDriver with the "Zusi" train simulator. It has a good calibration program that shows the raw
values as received from the controller. All levers are pretty exact with only a very small dead area. Just the combined throttle/brake lever responses badly. Between the full throttle (down) position and half the way to neutral the raw value does not change at all.

Does that make it a defect?

Last edited by Sighum (2016-11-30 18:13:28)

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#4 2016-12-01 12:34:12

DeanWaters
Member
Registered: 2016-12-01
Posts: 1

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Greetings

I am having this exact same issue.  My RailDriver unit is one day old (just got it yesterday via Amazon).  I've removed/reinstalled the software.  I am using the latest MacroWorks version downloaded from the RailDriver site yesterday.  I've re-calibrated several times.  I am using TS2017 with all the Steam updates applied.  This dead-zone behavior applies to all trains in TS2017.  If I can't find a solution, I'll need to return the unit.  The way it behaves with the dead-zone on the throttle is so annoying that it makes the unit unusable.

Dean
deanwaters@gmail.com

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#5 2016-12-01 16:16:56

PIE Amber
Technical Software Developer
From: Williamston, MI
Registered: 2016-01-21
Posts: 196
Website

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Question for both of the users with this problem: Which trains are you using? Specific names and routes would be very useful.

There is a known issue with trains with notched throttles. Can you guys check and see if you are getting this with all trains, or just notched throttle trains?


Amber from P.I. Engineering

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#6 2016-12-03 07:01:58

Sighum
Member
Registered: 2016-11-29
Posts: 3

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

The issue appears even with linear throttles - not only notched.

I tried in Train Simulator 2017 (Dovetail):

- Class 483 ET LT (linear), Isle of Wright
- Class 365 EMU First Capital Connect (notched), ECML London-Peterborough
- ICE-T, Hamburg-Hannover

All these trains show the same problem. 50% of each direction's range feels dead.


I also tried the "Zusi 3 Hobby" simulator:

- BR 218 (notched), Ruhrtalbahn (Aachen-Kassel)
  => feels a bit better than in TS2017 but also not quite precise

As I said in Zusi you can see the raw values and apparently the controller doesn't send any different values within the "dead" range.


Aerosoft (where I bought the raildriver) has offered me to send in the RailDriver to check it for defects. But I somehow doubt it's actually a hardware issue. I could imagine that +/-2 mm is the best that the controller can offer. So it might as well be a driver issue with TS2017.

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#7 2016-12-05 10:14:51

PIE Liam
Technical Support Specialist
From: Williamston, MI
Registered: 2016-01-21
Posts: 50
Website

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Sighum, Dean
I'm sorry to hear about this. If both of you could email me directly, we can try some more tests that will shed some light on whether or not this is a hardware issue. My name is "Liam" and you can email me at tech@piengineering.com .

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#8 2016-12-08 16:13:17

sparkchaser1200
Member
Registered: 2016-12-08
Posts: 1

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

HI,

Just got my Rail Driver installed and ran train today.  Having same problem as described.  Also several times the trottle would not go all the way to 0%.  Sticks at 14%.  Quickly cycled up and down that cleared the fault.

Noticed the LED speed indicator seems to "hunt" for the correct speed, fast then slow then correct. 

All I have done so far is work a free mode switch engine, SW1500.

Love it so far, just need a little tweeking.

Running Windows 10 on a Dell XPS desktop.

I will be glad to help to figure out this fault.

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#9 2016-12-09 14:17:24

PIE Liam
Technical Support Specialist
From: Williamston, MI
Registered: 2016-01-21
Posts: 50
Website

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

Sparkchaser1200,

as a hardware issue is exceedingly rare, please email me a tech@xkeys.com with your issue and we can start troubleshooting.

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#10 2017-01-03 21:01:45

JG123
Member
Registered: 2017-01-03
Posts: 1

Re: Hysteresis / dead area in analog sticks

I am also having this problem, I have just filled out the form online, but I figured I would add to this thread. Everything else works perfectly, just the throttle is acting strange, as if there is a deadspot. Reminds me of when mouse balls (yes before lasers  :D  ) had gunk built up on the rollers and the mouse would move erratically.

Please help me, otherwise I love this thing!!!


EDIT//

I have also followed the instructions from another post:
C:\Program Files (x86)\PI Engineering\MacroWorks 3.1 and double click the "DeviceFinder"  Select "Find Devices" and then highlight the RD  and select "Read Device" and start moving the levers around , do you see data being outputted?

and it doesn't respond properly, there seems to be a lag and quite the large dead-zones.

Last edited by JG123 (2017-01-03 21:07:59)

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